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April 14, 2004
Scientist Confirms Americans in Decline
The UK Telegraph has repeated a news blurb from the highest attainments of European science, which could've been titled "Americans Suck".
Americans have lost their height advantage, reports Kate Connolly in Munich
The New World has lost its superiority over the Old - at least in terms of physical stature - and John Komlos has the evidence to prove it. His records, including files on "runaway slaves", "indentured servants" and "West Point graduates", bear testament to the American decline.
As long as a story has the phrase "American decline" the European press will jump all over it. Now if they can just explain what this decline is, exactly.
Tech Central Station has already talked about this bit of "research". His samples for American heights are from the CDC which was intentionally oversampling the Americans who were most likely to develop problems, the poor and minorities.
Earlier this month the UK Guardian had a slightly more biased article than the already extremely biased UK Telegraph article.
Researchers have made a startling discovery: Americans are shrinking. A nation once famed for its strapping, well-nourished youth is gradually diminishing in physical stature.
This is European science at its finest. They can look at a table of averages. From there, they go flying off the deep end as they vault, lemming-like, into the murky depths of Eurocentric socialist thought.
By contrast, the heights of men and women from Europe are increasing inexorably. The average Dutchman, whose country produces the Continent's loftiest men, is now more than six feet tall - almost two inches above his American counterpart.
European heights are "increasing inexorably"? I guess in another century we'll be casting Swedish girls for "Attack of the fifty-foot woman" won't we? Yet in the real world, in rich countries, heights are pretty much peaked at their genetically determined values. The American counterpart to Dutchmen would be Americans of pure Dutch descent, not Americans as a whole.
The Dutch living in Holland are finally reaching the same height that Dutch Americans have had all this time, height differences which have been long noted in the literature. The reason the Dutch Americans shot up like weeds after leaving Holland is that Dutch are naturally tall, because, get this, their families are made up of tall people. Height has a genetic component, and in rich countries is considered 90% heritable. Vikings were big people, and Icelanders are still some of the tallest in the world.
And he is still growing. Across the Netherlands hotel owners are lengthening beds and raising door mantles to stop the nation's tall youth suffering from irreparable anatomical damage.
You might think this implies that the Dutch are becoming giants, but actually it's because most of the Dutch housing is prehistoric, by American standards, often with very low ceiling and door heights. For example, in reference to the height of Dutch grandfather clocks built about 200 years ago, this passage sheds some light.
A tall city-made clock will stand at about target="_blank">7ft to 7ft 6ins which can be some 12 to 18 inches more than a cottage's or say millhouse ceiling height at little over 6 feet.
Americans don't need to raise our door heights because we've always had tall Dutchmen running around. They just always had to be careful when they visited old housing in the mother country, because they'd get concussions from bumping into their relative's ceilings.
According to a New Yorker essay on the subject last week, Dutch ambulances are even having to keep their back doors open on many occasions to allow for the prodigious dimensions of their patients' legs.
Maybe they should quit driving Renaults or something, because American ambulances can handle football players without any problem.
New research has shown some unexpected disparities between statures of Americans and Europeans, indicating that recent social changes and diet are major influences on adult height.
Diet influences adult height? Who would've imagined that? I hope they don't forget that genetics is also a major factor, as shown by that 90% heritability number from twin studies. It's avoid those things that stunt your growth, like a famine from yet another European war, that tend to stunt childhood growth.
For British men, too, are outstripping their transatlantic rivals. At the time of the American Revolution, the average US male was two inches taller than his British counterpart. Today he is almost half an inch shorter.
But is the average American of pure British ancestry shorter than his British counterpart? That is the question. And interestingly, if you look at the CDC data the average white American is a half inch taller than the average American, which would make him exactly as tall as his British counterpart, which is proof that European socialism produces, um, what exactly?
This surprising reappraisal of American and European physiques is the work of researcher John Komlos of Munich University. 'Much of the difference is due to the great social inequality that now exists in the United States,' Komlos told The Observer last week. 'In Europe, there is - in most countries - good health service provision for most members of society and plenty of protein in most people's diets. As a result, children do not suffer illnesses that would blight their growth or suffer problems of malnutrition. For that reason, we have continued to grow and grow.'
Preach the glories of socialism, my comrade! Now tell us about the one year waiting list to see a doctor, or people lined up around the block when a NHS dentist comes to town. From comparing Americans, including a high proportion of non-Europeans, to Europeans, and only coming up with a half-inch difference, he's really reaching for some startling conclusions, isn't he? Now, I wonder how he'll explain the fact that black Americans are also taller than the average American. Is it because they've always been on top of the economic pyramid? I'd say his whole moonbat premise has just exploded into a million pieces.
On the other hand, America has eight million people with no job, 40 million individuals with no health insurance, 35 million living below the poverty line, and a population that exists mainly on junk food. There, the rise in average height that marked its progress as a nation through the 19th and 20th centuries has stopped and has actually reversed - albeit very slightly - in recent years. Many Americans are rich and do well anatomically as a result, but there is a large underclass that is starting to drag the country down the stature charts.
This gets interesting, since the average unemployment rate in Western Europe in 2001 was 7.1% while the US hasn't been above 6%, and yet this is "normal" for Europe. Germany and France have been running an 9% and 10% unemployment rate for ages. Yet this doesn't seem to stunt their physical stature. And the 2003 US "poverty line" included single people making $9500 a year and families making over $40,000 a year. Big families, to be sure, but this amount does not include food stamps and housing subsidies. And if the author would take a look at the US poor, he'd notice they tend to be, well, fat.
This discovery, which has been revealed through research that Komlos has assembled over decades, amounts to an assault on the values of the free market economy espoused by Americans and provides powerful support for those who back European ideas about universal healthcare.
Didn't I say the train would leave the tracks? We have wonderous proof of the glories of socialism, which can go right into the wastebasket. American's include a wildly varying sample of people, including all sorts of Native Americans, Pacific Islanders, Asians, and Africans. Yet this author argues that socialism must work because despite their historically flat Euroschlerotic growth rates, endemic high unemployement, and a one year wait to see a doctor, it must work, because Vikings are taller than Vietnamese boat people! This may be good though, because the Vietnamese could pack in more per longboat as they fled from the glories of socialism. Next up we can have a comparison of per capita GDP. Gee, by that measure it seems only three European countries can beat the US. Luxemberg, a country smaller than Rhode Island, so it might as well be a business district, Switzerland, which makes money off the gold that Europeans are always looting from each other, and Norway, which gets an advantage because of all that delicious whale meat in their diet.
Fluctuations in human stature are not new and have occurred regularly throughout history. Our early hunter-gatherer ancestors were tall and lean. Later, as farming spread across the world, dense populations learnt to live on only a few standard crops and suffered considerable nutritional neglect. The result was a decline in stature.
Most of the decline in height is from the conditions typical of a Charle's Dickens novel, or living off the meager food allowance that the European intelligentsia and nobles would deign to distribute to the masses. Maybe their poor really would've been better off eating cake. But if you look at people who weren't packed into city slums you get a slightly different picture. Analysis of the average height of Scots going back to the bronze age says they haven't grown a whole lot, being just about an inch taller than their long term height and just adding about a half inch to their 1850 stature. Oh, and the Scots, like the Americans, used to be taller than the English, but not anymore. Something about those London slums…
Similarly, climatic changes have had a profound effect on human height - a physical attribute that is now regarded by historians, scientists and economists as a key indicator of the health of any group of people living at any particular time and place. For example, during the Little Ice Age, in which temperatures plummeted across the world between 1300 and the mid-19th century, there was a noticeable decrease in human stature.
Stop the presses! A European paper just admitted that we're coming out of the Little Ice Age! Do you think that might indicate that temperatures should be slightly increasing? How did this little nugget slip past the editors? Oh, because it was part of an idiotic argument about American inferiority. They need to be more careful about slip-ups like that. Their multitude of anti-American biases is getting them so crossed up that they're blowing the story line. What the European press needs to do is to create a specialty position in the editing process to carry out "conspiracy and bias deconfliction" to prevent red-on-red fratricide.
'There are two possible mechanisms for this observation,' said Professor Chris Stringer of the Natural History Museum. 'Firstly, all mammals get shorter and rounder when climates cool. It is a physiological response to cold. Short, round bodies preserve heat better than tall cool ones.
Excuse me, but didn't Europeans have something called "clothing", or did he just miss the fact that the Dutch, where it's cold are taller than Guatamalans, where it's warm.
'However, there is an alternative explanation for shrinking stature in bad weather. It means poor crops, and that in turn means malnutrition and, of course, the consequence of that is poor stature.
He also completely forgot to mention the move into cities, where diets tended to be much poorer. Farmers used to always eat much better than city folk, because the farmer lived where the food was.
'Those tiny suits of armour that you see when you visit the Tower of London were worn by people who were badly nourished. During winter they would have only salt meat and a few vegetables to live on. That's not going to help you grow very well.'
And this diet is different from the American diet of the 1800's, when we were tall, in what way? If he'd investigate further he'd find that there are two very common sizes of surviving medieval armor, extra small and extra large. What we have left are the suits that didn't fit anybody but the oddball that wore them. Most historical studies from battlefield remains have concluded that the combatants were almost as tall as we are now.
Modern society now protects humans from such problems, though in recent years it has become clear that political factors are having some effect on nutrition levels and proper diet and therefore stature. And it is in this arena that Komlos has made his key discoveries.
Did he discover that food is good? You know, if this is the highpoint of European scientific research into nutrition maybe he should pass it along to those North Koreans.
Through painstaking investigations he has calculated the heights of men at different times over our recent historical past. This shows that, around 1850, Americans - blessed with Western technology that allowed its citizens to spread unstoppably across the United States - lived relatively fine lives that let its menfolk reach an average height of 5ft 9in. By contrast, Dutchmen were only able to reach about 5ft 7in.
Isn't it funny how he tries to credit American height with "Western" technology. But why would our advantage over Europeans be due to "Western" technology?
By the early 20th century the average American man was still about the same height as his predecessor. But the average Dutchman had nearly caught up and was only about half an inch shorter.
Oh, so the Dutch had already made up 75% of their height deficit versus Americans decades before the advent of all that social intervention. How is that possible? I thought the author was trying to credit everything to universal health care, not the canning industry.
But in the 20th century Americans were overtaken. The average US male is now about 5ft 10in. The average Dutchman is just over 6ft.
Well it's nice to see that the Dutch are back to having all the nutrition they did during the medieval period, when they could get just about as tall. Must've been all those free state provided blood-letting services back then.
More importantly, the latter is continuing his rise in average height. The Americans have long since stopped growing and, according to some measures, may actually be getting smaller. 'In relative terms, Americans are certainly shrinking in comparison with Europeans,' says Komlos.
Amazingly, we're even lagging behind the former East Germans, so maybe that communism thing worked out for them after all. Onward, comrades!
One possible explanation lies with immigration. As more Mexicans and Chinese enter the US, these individuals may lower the average height, it is argued. But statisticians dismiss this suggestion. During the 19th century the country took in millions of malnourished, and therefore small, people. Yet Americans remained the tallest people in the world at that time.
Those have to be some seriously stupid statisticians, then. Since height is 90% heritable, the idea that current immigrants, many of whom come from countries where the people are shorter than Europeans, can't have a depressing effect on average height because the older waves of taller European immigrants didn't is absolutely, breathtakingly invalid. The European immigrants may have been malnourished, which isn't surprising for people fleeing Europe, but once they had access to the American cornucopia they cooked up an abundance of fine European dishes. Some of the new Hispanic immigrants are taking a few generations to get their full genetic stature, and Hispanics as a whole in America are an inch shorter than non-Hispanic whites and blacks, so maybe the statisticians need to go over these numbers again.
In fact, the very idea that various peoples are programmed, on average, to be short or tall is thrown into doubt by Komlos's work. Apart from a few rare races, such as African pygmies who are genetically programmed to have low stature, virtually everyone in the world has the potential to reach the same average height as the Dutch, and that includes the Mexicans, Chinese, Inuit, and other peoples who are not usually noted for their stature.
With height being 90% heritable, according to twin studies, I would find that shocking. Let's use Ockham's razor and instead throw out Komlos's "research", since I read it and find it compares quite closely to mindless dreck churned out for a high-school science fair project, but without all the validity. I'll point out that his research has 15 end-notes, the first being the definition of body mass index, the second saying "There are also interaction effects among the independent variables not considered here", and so on. Let's just say I wouldn't call them endnotes. I'd call them "asides".
To achieve that status will require some arduous social engineering. The Dutch health service, with its magnificent support services for pregnant woman (quality of life in the womb is a key factor in determining future health and height) and its high-protein diets based on dairy food, will not be easy to emulate in a world whose population is now soaring towards seven billion.
It won't be easy to emulate in Rotterdam, either, where the majority of the population is Muslim. With about 10% of the population tracing from Muslim countries like Indonesia, do you think he'd include these massive numbers of Muslim immigrants in his height data? I kind of doubt it. If he did, it would be the European's who appear to be shrinking, now wouldn't it? If he can discount any effects from our Hispanic immigration while including them in our averages, then I don't see why we shouldn't do the same. And I suspect that he did it intentionally, since the CDC data he used as a source specifically seperated out Hispanics, whereas in his paper he says
Actually, average heights for the whole population are almost the same as those of whites by themselves, inasmuch as whites make up 90 percent of the population (Figures 1, 2, and 6). Hence, in subsequent analysis the heights of whites is not reported separately, only those of the whole population and of the African-Americans are.
What a dodge. Hispanics disappear into the data, and the entire population is taken to be "white", since the whole population includes African-Americans, Hispanics, Asians, etc. I'll close with the abstract from his paper, which right away gives you an idea of the science to BS ratio in his paper.
Abstract: Within the course of the 20th century the American population went through a metamorphosis from being the tallest in the world, to being among the most overweight. The American height advantage over Western and Northern Europeans was between 3-9 cm in the middle of the 19th century. Americans were also underweight. However, today, the exact opposite is the case as the Dutch, Swedes, and Norwegians are the tallest, and the Danes, British and Germans – even the East-Germans - are also taller, towering over the Americans by as much as 3-7 cm. Americans also live shorter. The hypothesis is worth considering that this adverse development is related to the greater social inequality, an inferior health-care system, and fewer social safety nets in the United States than in Western and Northern Europe, in spite of higher per capita income. The West- and Northern European welfare states, with cradle to grave health and unemployment insurance currently provide a more propitious environment for the biological standard of living than its US counterpart.
Or maybe a simpler explaination is that European scientists are looking for a way to justify more social spending.
April 14, 2004 in Science | Permalink
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Comments
This is proof positive that the sublime American plan to turn Europeans into a bunch of brainless dolts is working like a charm (no change there, we've been putting it across them for over 200 years).
Posted by: Sean at Apr 15, 2004 5:26:30 AM
Excellent analysis.
When I originally came across this article, I ran into the "everyone can be the same height with the same nutrition" BS line, and looked at my 6 ft 3 in husband, who's been drinking coffee since he was 4, then considered myself at 5 ft 4 in who guzzled down milk well into adulthood. Of course, Stu is the runt in his extended family -- his male cousins are hulks beside him (e.g. 6 ft 7 in), and I'm taller than my sisters and quite a few of my female cousins.... Anyway, how did they think the heritability of height would slip past people? Short parents have short kids, and tall parents have tall kids in America (my past is odd, in that in each case, parents and grandparents, one was tall and the other short for their sex. Of course, it's playing out in my own family; my 10-mo old daughter is already taller than many 2-yr-old girls.)
We don't run into famines here, at least not lately, but definitely in no widespread phenomenon as our country is so big and we haven't had many continental wars. I'm sure our rationing in WWII was less harsh than that seen by the Europeans -- and they had the hit during WWI as well. In fact, I believe rationing extended well after WWII in England. They had a big nutrition deficit to make up for -- it's good to see they're eating well now.
I got here from Steven den Beste's place. I will definitely be coming back.
Posted by: Meep at Apr 15, 2004 5:37:32 AM
Um, wow. This is what passes for science in Europe? I learned enough to debunk that in elementary school in Mississippi fer Christ's sake! Height is decided by what you eat; not genetics? Ha! Komlos has a lot of explaining to do, then on why I'm shorter than my grandmother but ate a lot healthier than she did as a kid.
Phoenix
Posted by: Phoenix at Apr 15, 2004 9:35:54 AM
Wow, George, how do you stomach this tripe long enough to wade through it and debunk it?
I got bored three paragraphs in, and just skipped around, reading your well done fisking.
What confused me is this guy compared the Dutch population to Americas as if we were all Dutch. And then he did the same thing for England.
So, what are we? All Dutch or all English?
Posted by: Russell at Apr 15, 2004 11:38:38 AM
Ah, the blogosphere, without which I would never be continually proven wrong in thinking that the standards of the media won't go any lower.
I think I'm going to go cry now.
Posted by: LabRat at Apr 15, 2004 2:44:31 PM
*hands labrat a kleenix*
I could do an analysis of the size of NFL linemen or NBA players over the years and prove the exact opposite and it would be just as meaningless.
Oh, and it wouldn't take twenty years either. That's the sad part of this, anyone else think about that? The article says this guy has spent twenty years studying this.
Posted by: Calliope at Apr 15, 2004 3:15:04 PM
Indeed. He studies it for 20 years and only cites ONE research study by the CDC that was on a completely different topic?
Just the fact that black Americans are TALLER than average Americans would blow out the validity of his argument, since it's well documented that blacks on average don't get the same quality of health care, pre-natal care, etc. If his conclusion was correct, the NBA would be made up almost entirely of rich liberals from Boston and a poor kid from the projects wouldn't even be on the bench.
It reminds me of another bit of "research" that was published in a medical journal in the UK, showing a statistical correlation between the length of the lifeline (used by palm-readers) and age at death. The doctors went into the morgue and took the measurements! Duh. People who die at an older age have are wrinklier than those who die young. Who'da thunk it.
Posted by: George Turner at Apr 15, 2004 5:07:56 PM
Well, I know this isn't science, but the anecdotal evidence from just GOING TO EUROPE proves that Komlos is full of shit. ALthough I'm taller than average (6'4"), I REGULARLY see men in the U.S. my height or taller. I see LOTS of guys who are within an inch or two of my height (at 6'2", still taller than average). Last time I was in Europe, over a two week period, I saw exactly TWO men who were my height or taller. I RARELY saw anyone over 6'. So, what gives, Komlos? I can tell you one thing for darn sure - he isn't including the Muslim, African, etc. immigrants into Europe in his height charts, because they are even smaller than the "white" Europeans.
What a complete fucktard.
Posted by: Flagwaver at Apr 15, 2004 8:49:16 PM
Why the HELL am I only 5' 8 1/2"??!! I ate like a horse when I was a kid (Meat, veggies, dairy, you name it...) and I stopped growing UP when I turned 16. I grew out in all directions (Thank you, three USAF squares a day for 10 years. And beer. Can't forget the beer.) but, according to this Socialist parasite, I should be 7' 2" and look NBA players in the eye.
Next, he'll be telling us how superior the *spit* European *spit* "militaries" (Do they actually have 'em anymore?) are to the US's.
Can I get a "social safety net", such as a guaranteed life-time job making up shit and calling it "science"?
Posted by: B.C., Imperial Torturer™ at Apr 15, 2004 9:23:36 PM
Well, on the up side BC, taller Europeans can reach higher when they wave white flags.
I wonder if there's evolutionary pressure to give them longer legs and arms, just for that reason?
Posted by: George Turner at Apr 15, 2004 10:30:09 PM
http://dissectleft.blogspot.com/2004_04_18_dissectleft_archive.html#108223014914281957
THE "SHORT AMERICAN" NONSENSE
I am rather surprised that the story about some Europeans being taller than Americans has attracted such a lot of attention without anyone (as far as I can see) tumbling to what the finding really shows. Even the careful Iain Murray missed it. The finding, in brief, was that the average American height has stopped increasing but average heights in some European countries have not. And some Europeans -- such as the Dutch -- are much taller than Americans on average. The data underlying the finding may not be all that sound but let us assume that they are:
Anti-American commentators have linked the finding to nutrition -- saying that it shows Americans to be poorly nourished. Given the "obesity epidemic" in America, that is a pretty hilarious explanation but it does contain the grain of truth that there is some connection between nutrition and height. As the geneticists (such as Eaves et al., 1999) have shown, final height is a product of genetic potential plus environmental influences -- and nutrition is undoubtedly one of those environmental influences. Putting it another way, your full genetic potential is realized only when the environmental conditions are ideal. So what the data really show is that ONLY IN AMERICA have the ideal environmental conditions for height maximization been realized. That is why Americans have stopped growing. America ALREADY has gained all it can from nutrition etc. The fact that European heights are still growing shows, then, that they still do not have ideal conditions there for realizing their maximum height. They are still catching up. In short, the data show exactly the opposite to what has been claimed: It is Europeans who are lacking in something that influences height. The traditional European habit of consuming fruit and vegetables in preserved and pickled form rather than in fresh form may be the nutritional factor involved.
An immediate objection to my account is of course the fact that SOME Europeans are much taller than Americans on average. How can they be so tall if they have bad nutrition (or whatever else has been holding them back)? Once again the answer is to be found in the Eaves et al (1999) study: The MAIN influence on height is genetics so if coastal North Western Europeans (such as the Dutch and the Scandinavians) have good genetics for height they will still be taller on average even if their nutrition is not ideal. And that coastal North-Western Europeans tend to be very tall has been known at least since the Viking age. Why they have long been among the world's tallest people (along with some very dubiously nourished East Africans) nobody knows for sure but only a small percentage of the American population is of coastal North Western European ancestry so the final American average must be much lower. And the fact that the legionaries of the ancient Roman empire were real shorties suggests that average national height is a very minor factor (if it is a factor at all) in national achievement and felicity.
Reference
Eaves, L.J., Martin, N.G., Meyer, J.M. & Corey, L.A. (1999) "Biological and cultural inheritance of stature and attitudes". In: Cloninger, C.R., Personality and psychopathology. Washington, D.C.: American Psychiatric Press.
**********************************
Posted by: John Ray at Apr 17, 2004 10:46:32 PM
Thanks John!
I'd like to mention that since height is heritable, the reason some people's end up taller is because their parents were taller, whose parents were taller, etc. You could breed the NBA and the WNBA together and produce a bunch of tall people, too.
What's interesting is that women tend to like tall men, and men tend to like short women. Recent data showed that shorter women had more babies per mom than taller women. Our species is essentially trying to go two different directions regarding height. Based on with winds of fashion in mate choice, there will be otherwise inexplicable height swings in smaller groups.
Posted by: George Turner at Apr 17, 2004 11:32:11 PM
This idiot is not understanding the concept of heritability or h^2. He also misunderstands Komlos' data.
Posted by: Nomandra at Apr 20, 2004 8:26:56 PM
What the eff does the majority population of Rotterdam have ANYTHING to do with height or diet? Who cares if they're Muslim? That's not what this is about. If you were going to argue that the influx of immigrants from Muslim countries is shrinking the average European height, that's what you should have argued. That they happen to be Muslim is irrelevant.
Posted by: Simplicity Is at Dec 13, 2008 2:36:23 PM





